09 June 2011 @ 03:56 pm
The Women Men Won't See  
My boyfriend for the first part of my college career was a comic book collector, which meant that he had three billion carefully stored comic books, all of which had to be read with the same care you'd use when handling the original copy of the Declaration of Independence, and then replaced in their individual plastic sleeves and their specific spot in their long boxes. (There was a special technique for getting them into the boxes undamaged.) He was extremely anxious for me to share his interest in comic books, and he spent a fair amount of time telling me about them, giving me important ones to read, and, of course, taking me to comic book shops.

Because he was a collector, he was well known to the comic book shop owners (I believe they gave little cries of joy when they saw him coming), and I was introduced as his girlfriend and welcomed into the fold. I spent a lot of time browsing at random while he chatted with the guys behind the counter, and I was young enough that it didn't occur to me that it might be significant that it was always, always guys behind the counter.

At that age, I was an easy sell on basically any story you cared to show me. I was happy to have new things to read. And I grew to love the comic books themselves, and especially the characters in them. My boyfriend didn't have a clue how to sell me on comic books - really, he should have pointed to two guys and used the words "unresolved sexual tension" and that would have done it - but he did pay attention to what I responded to. I loved Rogue. She was exactly the right character for an angsty sixteen-year-old girl. In particular, I obsessively read the issue in which she's trapped in her own brain; in there, it's strongly implied (or possibly outright stated; this was a long time ago, after all) that she's been raped. I loved that - Rogue had been raped, some time in her past, and she'd certainly made mistakes, but she was still tough, still on the team, still saving people. "Fucked up but strong" pretty much describes the Rogue characterization of the time, and that was exactly what I wanted from my female characters. I was fucked up, and I wanted to be strong, and there was Rogue, being my wish fulfillment in spandex.

My boyfriend assumed it was the rape itself that interested me, and offered more books featuring women being raped or abused. Since they weren't the heroes, and it wasn't about them getting over it - they were being rescued, or, you know, not being rescued - it didn't interest me. But I liked that he tried. And I was young enough that it didn't occur to me that it might be significant that he could find so many plotlines about women being raped or abused, and that all of them were told in precisely the way guaranteed to turn me off.

So, you know how it goes: we broke up. I ended up with Best Beloved, the woman I'm still married to. And I didn't realize it right away, but comic books were one of the things I lost in the divorce.

No, not the actual books themselves; I kept the ones that were mine, and in fact I still have them, five moves later. Not even the mutual interest in them - Best Beloved was a comic book reader, too, until she had so many series cut off from underneath her that she gave up and turned to things less likely to destroy her loves, like, you know, Fox. What I lost was my pass into the world of comic books.

The first time I tried to go into a comic book store without my boyfriend, I discovered that I had a superpower in the comic book world. I was invisible. I could not get anyone to acknowledge that I existed. There were guys behind the counter, yes, but they kept up their argument about Green Lantern while I stood in front of them. I had to interrupt, finally, to ask my question, and then I discovered my second superpower: I had a wall of silence surrounding me. They exchanged glances, gestured vaguely to the back of the store, and went right back to their argument. I left without finding the book I'd come for, but that's just as well; I don't think, based on future experiences, I could have gotten them to take my money if I'd found it.

I thought it was just that comic book store. Then I thought it was just that one and the next one, the one where I discovered that I could not force my money into the hands of the guy behind the counter; he walked away from the register when I approached with books in hand, then disappeared into the back of the store for, apparently, eternity. It was crazy; it was like I'd gone back in time a hundred years, and they still had Wolverine everywhere.

In the third store where my new superpowers came into play, I had what was, at that time in my life, an unaccustomed thought. Why am I doing this? I should not have to beg people to take my money.

I realized I didn't want to have to force my way in through doors that had "NO GIRLZ ALOWD" signs on them, doors I apparently needed a male escort to get through. I loved comic books, but I didn't love them enough to put up with that shit. So I didn't. And eventually I didn't love comic books anymore, either.

But that was more than fifteen years ago. Things have changed. I've seen the campaigns online. I've seen the maps of girl-friendly comic book stores. (Although, seriously, just that these exist is an indication of a major problem in the industry; you don't see maps of girl-friendly hardware stores, for example, because all hardware stores are girl-friendly. They employ women! They take our money! They provide us with non-condescending advice! They have gloves in our size! At least all the ones I've been in, and I'm a homeowner, so you can see that I spend a lot of time in hardware stores. The question isn't, "Which hardware store will treat me like a person despite my gender?" It's, "Which hardware store is closest to my house and stocks the items I need?" If you have to ask the former question, there is a big problem.) I've even read articles about how to get girls into your comic book shop, so clearly owners now understand that accepting money from only a fraction of the people interested in giving it to you is not always the world's most successful business strategy.

That's why, yesterday, I decided to stop into a comic book store. Totally on a whim. Just to see what it's like in there these days, how things have changed since the days of dialup. I thought I might want to get something with Oracle in it, to remember her by.

I walked in towing my unwilling three-year-old son, who had already come to the conclusion that this was a destination unlikely to have any trucks or Pigeon books in it, and therefore did not wish to go in. I blinked, letting my eyes adjust, and, man, comic book store interiors really haven't changed that much. I mean, the posters have - I think they've developed new breast enlarging technology, for starters, and it's not like the breasts were small before - but the interiors are still exactly the same.

"Hi!" the guy behind the counter said in cheerful tones, and I thought: But they have changed where it really matters.

Except he wasn't looking at me. He was looking at my son, who was clinging to my leg. "What can I find for you today?" he asked him. "Spiderman? Superman? Toys?"

"We're here for me," I said. "He's too young for comic books."

"You're never too young for comic books!" he said, still exclusively addressing the earthling. "I bet you like superheroes, huh?" (He doesn't.)

The earthling, apparently feeling threatened, asked to be picked up. I eavesdropped on a few more minutes of conversation that didn't involve me, even though I was the only member of my party willing to talk, and then I left. I pretty much had to; the earthling, distressed by this onslaught of talking despite all his Mama's attempts to redirect the conversation, had his face buried in my neck and was saying, "All done, all done, go home now?" very quietly into my ear. But in the time I was in the store, not one single word was addressed to me, let alone enough words to ask me, say, if there was anything I needed help finding. The guy never even looked at me. I was still invisible.

The only thing that's changed in fifteen years, apparently, is that I gave birth to someone who can be my passport into comic book stores. Except he doesn't want to be, and I don't want him to have to be, so that isn't going to work so well. I'm going to have to remember Oracle with icons and scans and fan fiction, instead of something that costs actual money.

But, hey, reboots happen regularly, and I'm sure Oracle will be coming around again. Eventually. So I'll see you in another decade or so, comic book store guys! In the meantime, thanks for keeping my money in my purse, where it belongs.

Also posted at Dreamwidth, where there are comments.
 
 
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( 114 comments — Leave a comment )
junnights[info]junnights on June 9th, 2011 11:19 pm (UTC)
Wince - sounds awful - can believe that they're that sexist - STILL!... it should be more about 'customer! - help buy lots so she'll return to buy more' than 'Woman! - ignore or risk getting cooties!'...

Just glad I never truly started reading comic... O_O

- a fellow woman

... just wish that true equality between sexes was more than spoken words.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 03:11 am (UTC)
I hear that there are places - even comic book stores! - where women are treated just like ordinary customers. It's kind of sad that that's a major selling point for them, though. "Come visit us! We'll act like you're human!"
Thorn[info]thornsilver on June 9th, 2011 11:20 pm (UTC)
I didn't have this kind of experience in the comic book store near my job, but I had this experience in the gaming store near my job. While I was browsing around the counter guy looked at me like I was going to possibly turn into a human eating monster if he was not looking. Seriously, obviously the nearly completely empty store did not need my money at all.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 03:17 am (UTC)
GIRLS CAN ALSO BE GEEKS, GUYS. LOOK INTO IT.

But, hey, obviously they were better off without your pink-stained money!
Smitty: Girls Rule[info]smittywing on June 9th, 2011 11:31 pm (UTC)
Ugh ugh ugh. This is epic levels of fail. I have been fortunate enough to have had a "home" comic book store that was the exact opposite of this. It was in a college town and it was owned by a gentleman in his thirties who worked for and purchased it from the previous owner. This gentleman had a wife who was also a comics fan, and she often worked in the store. (Their daughter was named Aeryn, after the Farscape character, which gives you an idea of how awesome they are.) Not only was I welcomed, treated like a customer, and even as a friend, they also went out of their way to ask my opinion on various storylines and co-opted me to explain storylines on books they didn't keep up with or recommend good starting comics or expansion comics to women who walked into the store. In addition to that, Joe once busted out his Friends of Lulu pamphlet on making comic book stores female-friendly and asked me to evaluated his efforts. He had kiddie comics in the front with toys and a little table and chairs for younger audiences (I do have to agree that one is never too young for comic books! although I probably should have been older than seven when I got that X-Men one with Rachael Summers in the dominatrix outfit) and the giant boobies are pushed back toward the cordoned-off adults-only room.

In the interest of full disclosure, Joe did admit that they put the Sandman trades on a higher shelf so the undergrads taking the English Lit course on graphic novels would have to either stretch or ask for help. No one's perfect. :P

So yeah. I am so sorry your comic book store experiences still suck. If you are ever in Delaware, let me know and I will drive up and meet you and introduce you to the best comic store ever. It makes me sad that they are the exception and not the rule, because even though I haven't really read them in several years, I love comics and I love superheroes and it's so so hard to be feminist and enjoy comics as a hobby without the dichotomy bringing about head explosion.

*hugs*
tried to eat the safe banana: Big eyes[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 03:25 am (UTC)
Wow. I would love to visit that comic book store. Child friendliness! Limited giant boobs! (I actually cut from this essay, since it is already too long, a side note about another comic book store I used to live near, which advertised its presence with a statue of Leia outside. Except they modified her white outfit to be sexy - slit all the way up both sides, and with a bra instead of, you know, the actual top. I never bothered going in there.) Tormenting of undergraduates! Sounds awesome.
(no subject) - [info]raisintorte on June 16th, 2011 02:34 am (UTC) (Expand)
Perri: dw wtf rose[info]neonhummingbird on June 9th, 2011 11:33 pm (UTC)
Huh. It's fascinating -- and depressing -- to read this, and realize that my experience 15 years ago was so antithetical. I remember being one of only 5 women, on average, at the comic cons I went to, and getting quite a lot of attention from the men I interacted with. At the small comic store I frequented in college, I was quite good buddies with the counter guy and his best friend. They were both genuinely nice guys, darlings really -- and they were both in their 20s, and had apparently figured out that "girl who likes comics" = "my best chance of getting laid". And it honestly baffles me that you apparently kept finding comic book store guys who hadn't yet made that connection.

(I'm not saying the possibility of getting laid is the only reason for guys to treat women like they're, you know, people and/or paying customers. Because that's stupid and annoying. But as a guy motive, it's often compelling....)
tried to eat the safe banana: Elektra is angry[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 03:28 am (UTC)
I have to assume that the stores I visited 15 years ago were manned (and I use that term advisedly) entirely by persons uninterested in women on any level - conversational, economical, sexual. It's a mystery how they managed to FIND that many guys like that.
(no subject) - [info]vassilissa on June 10th, 2011 03:44 pm (UTC) (Expand)
anna: diner girls[info]annaalamode on June 9th, 2011 11:34 pm (UTC)
See, this just makes me appreciate my comic book store more. And their interest in hooking me up with comics that involved women blowing shit up/shooting things. But if it makes you feel any better, I have spent the better part of my life being consistently ignored whenever I attempt to make conversation in mixed company about sports!
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 03:31 am (UTC)
I cheer for your comic book store! And, uh, sorry about the sports thing. (I have minimal interest in team sports, but I am always willing to talk about them. I love hearing about things other people find interesting.)
shayheyred[info]shayheyred on June 9th, 2011 11:35 pm (UTC)
Yrrrgghh.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 03:39 am (UTC)
You said it, Shay.
the pirate queen of norway[info]ashkitty on June 9th, 2011 11:43 pm (UTC)
Wow. That's pretty horrible. I've been to a lot of comic stores in three different countries, and in all but one, there were guys tripping over themselves to show me stuff. (The one exception was in Portland, and staffed by a girl with pink hair and a nose ring who I would have loved to talk to, but oh well.) The same happened in gaming stores (often the same places, admittedly), but on a bigger scale--I just wanted to go in, buy my miniatures and a magazine or two and leave, but there was usually somebody who felt the need to tell me all about how their 18th level paladin killed Tiamat or something.
tried to eat the safe banana: Big eyes[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 05:58 am (UTC)
Oh man. I will confess to kind of secretly loving the "Let me tell you about this one campaign we had this one time" conversations. I love hearing how other people play, what modifications to the rules they use and so on. But, really, that kind of conversation should require advance consent, because for so many people it is the ESSENCE of boring. Even for people who do RPGs, it's incredibly dull.

I have also had the guys tripping over themselves to show me stuff reaction. Overall, it bothers me less, although of course for other people that might not be true. But, really, what I would like is to be treated like a human being. Not the Girl in the [Comics, Gaming, Etc.] Shop.
(no subject) - [info]ashkitty on June 10th, 2011 11:19 am (UTC) (Expand)
whipsy: *facepalm*[info]whipsy on June 9th, 2011 11:43 pm (UTC)
Ugh, horrible and frustrating! Had the same experience, down to my son being addressed and not me. We don't frequent that particular comic book store anymore, but have found one that's the complete opposite! =)
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 06:01 am (UTC)
My sympathies! Obviously! I'm glad you found a store that works for you, and I'm sort of hoping I can do the same.
Proactively Untwist Octagonal Hippopotamus Pants: kestrel[info]dramaturgca on June 9th, 2011 11:43 pm (UTC)
My comic book store in Canada was awesome. (There were three in a row, one of the "ew girls" variety, one of the "give us your money" variety, and one small awesome really friendly variety.

Unfortunately, the one closest to my house here is of the "OMG GIRL WHAT DO I DOOOOOOOO?!?!?!?!" variety. :( I'm going to a thing at Meltdown in Hollywood on Sunday and I'm hoping that they will prove non-stupid.
Spectacles H. Decolonizing[info]lolaraincoat on June 10th, 2011 12:43 am (UTC)
You aren't, by any chance, talking about Toronto?
(no subject) - [info]dramaturgca on June 10th, 2011 12:45 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]lolaraincoat on June 10th, 2011 12:47 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]foi_nefaste on June 10th, 2011 02:26 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]lolaraincoat on June 10th, 2011 02:42 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]ide_cyan on June 10th, 2011 06:44 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 04:03 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]dramaturgca on June 10th, 2011 10:14 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Adina[info]adina_atl on June 9th, 2011 11:44 pm (UTC)
I only have experience with two comic book stores, but both of mine have been positive. The one twenty years ago was more than willing to take my money (less willing to give me money for some old ones I wanted to get rid of *grin*, but still friendly and helpful about it). Most of my questions were of the "Has issue [X] of [Y] arrived yet?" but they always got answered and the owner seemed to remember me from visit to visit. The more recent one is owned by a woman, but quite frankly she's one of the most abrasive and least helpful of the staff--but as far as I can tell, she's as abrasive to guys as to women. The other employees, both male and female, have been universally helpful and non-condescending. Other than the store cat, of course, who is *always* condescending--and usually sleeping on the box you want to look at.

I'm sorry your experiences have been so negative. I wouldn't think that Michigan and Ohio would be hot-beds of comic book egalitarianism! Both my experiences were in college towns, though. Maybe that makes a difference?
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 04:06 pm (UTC)
College towns do help! Also, I think, it may just be random luck. I looked at the Yelp reviews of the one I went to when I got home; if I'd done that before going, I never would have.

I'm glad you've had such great comic book store experiences, though.
A pink plastic crypt that fits in your palm: Blood Ties [Vicki/sword][info]fiveforsilver on June 9th, 2011 11:54 pm (UTC)
So I've never been dismissed as a customer (no, I probably have, I just don't remember offhand), but I went to a science fiction book club with a guy I was dating (which was of course almost entirely men) and they all thought that I was just there to hang out with my boyfriend. Like, they reassured me that I didn't have to read the books, there was always a lot of non-book-conversation.

Thanks, but I read almost exclusively science fiction and fantasy. They didn't even ask, they just assumed.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 04:09 pm (UTC)
Yeeesh. Girls like books, too! Even SPECULATIVE FICTION BOOKS, sometimes! Arg.
(no subject) - [info]fiveforsilver on June 10th, 2011 06:55 pm (UTC) (Expand)
JaneDavitt[info]janedavitt on June 9th, 2011 11:59 pm (UTC)
Oh my gosh. I've never had that experience. We all, as a family, went into two comic stores in London (Ontario) a month or so back and the men owning them were very chatty and friendly to me and Eleanor, fetching stuff from the back when she said what she was into, suggesting alternatives.

It sucks that you had that experience ::hugs::

Maybe it's Canada :-)
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 04:11 pm (UTC)
Possibly! Although I am hearing (on DW) about some bad comics stores in Canada. It's a sad day when even Canada is not immune. But I'm glad you've had excellent experiences. That is how it should always be.
winter_elf: Not Normal-Daniel[info]winter_elf on June 10th, 2011 12:05 am (UTC)
My local comic book store - the counter person was a girl (who was a Buffy fan) and we always chatted and I was never ignored. Unfortunately, this shop closed and I haven't been able to find one I like since. I tried one, and it was all superhero type comics, when I like more independent stuff, so I haven't been back.

I guess that's why I like Comic Con so much - and crawling the 'independent' comic book row. Often you can't get them to STOP talking to you, and you feel guilty for not buying a book.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 04:14 pm (UTC)
Oh, man, Comic Con. To me that sounds like a world of Too Many People. But I love looking at the pictures and seeing all the various people who are into comics. (And so many of them have such amazing sewing skills.) I admit I'm a little surprised that so many geeks go to Comic Con and then come back to their stores and continue to believe that only guys are into comics. A mystery!
Minim Calibre[info]minim_calibre on June 10th, 2011 12:06 am (UTC)
The comic book store I shopped at was so girl-friendly that I kept my pulls for YEARS after comics and I were On a Break.

Other ones... Yeah. No.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batman in the spotlight[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 04:59 pm (UTC)
Yay for the girl-friendly one, though! *focuses on the positive*
salmon don't dazzle: DC - Kara and Streaky[info]greensilver on June 10th, 2011 12:07 am (UTC)
I've had a fair number of borderline to blatant problematic comic shop experiences, but mine have almost always been on the opposite end of the spectrum: the over-solicitous shop guy. The over-solicitous shop guy will bypass male customers to help out the token female customer, because she probably needs it more, right? He might ask who she's shopping for, or he might actually assume she's shopping for herself and steer her toward female-friendly titles. (When I got [info]sweetestdrain into Captain America and she went to her local store to pick up some issues, her over-solicitous shop guy tried to get her to read Daredevil instead, because it had romance.) If she asks where the trades are, he might helpfully explain what a trade is. I've run into quite a few of these dudes in my time as a comics fan, and no, it don't impress me much.

Thankfully, both of my favorite shops in Seattle and my favorite shop here don't have that problem. My current shop in particular is co-run by a husband and wife pair, and the vibe there is always inclusive.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 12th, 2011 09:40 pm (UTC)
For me, the over-solicitous shop guy was much more likely to happen in a video game store. "HI I CAN POINT YOU TO ALL THE FARMING SIMS." (I do actually like farming sims. I just also like other games, dude.) "WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO TELL YOU ABOUT MY WARCRAFT CHARACTER?" (No.) "LET'S TALK AT LENGTH WHILE I STAND TOO CLOSE TO YOU!" (No.) Apparently comics stores hire that same guy! He gets around.

And, man: Hi, you're a girl! Obviously you need some ROMANCE in your comics! (I sincerely hope [info]sweetestdrain said, "Actually, I wanted Captain America. Later, I plan to write about Cap and Iron Man fucking.")

I cheer for your favorite shops, though!
The Moonlight Sonata: idrake by diamond_dust06[info]moonlight69 on June 10th, 2011 12:14 am (UTC)
Wow. I never realised I was so lucky in my comic book store/gaming store dealings. I have never had anything but helpful gentlemen (and the occasional woman, but it was mostly men) when I've gone into a comic book store, and I've gone to several, in multiple cities and states. If I'd ever been treated with that level of disregard I would have certainly turned around and walked right back out.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batman in the spotlight[info]thefourthvine on June 12th, 2011 09:43 pm (UTC)
Yay for good comic book stores and gaming stores! And, yeah, walking out is all you can do.
Merlin Missy: Big Scary Freak[info]mtgat on June 10th, 2011 12:18 am (UTC)
That is incredibly NOT OKAY.

My local comic book store was fantastic about treating me as a customer. They weren't over-solicitous and never once did they assume I was there for my SO. The guys who worked the counter knew me (the stroller was awfully hard to miss) and the owner/manager regularly recced me titles that were based on the things I enjoyed, and I enjoyed the recs. They did treat the kids as customers, on the occasions the kids were picking out their own favorite titles and bringing them up to the counter. I only stopped going because I couldn't justify the monthly expense on books I wasn't enjoying.

It's an expensive habit, but I wish I could show you the shop just so you could have the positive experience. :/
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 12th, 2011 09:50 pm (UTC)
I am considering engaging in a Comics Store Project so I can have some positive experiences! In the meantime, I am extremely happy to hear about yours. Yay for great comics stores! (I am deeply impressed that you found a store you could navigate in a stroller. The one with the earthing-talker would have been impossible for a stroller, and a wheelchair user would have been shit out of luck. But then I assume there are no comics fans who use wheelchairs, just like there are no comics fans who are girls.)
Proactively Untwist Octagonal Hippopotamus Pants: bionic woman - get a man with a gun[info]dramaturgca on June 10th, 2011 12:30 am (UTC)
Had I the money, I would open a totally female friendly nerd store. If there can be feminist porn/sex stores, why not comic shops too?
the pirate queen of norway[info]ashkitty on June 10th, 2011 01:57 am (UTC)
In one town where I used to live, a lesbian couple owned the comic shop AND the porn shop. ;)
(no subject) - [info]dramaturgca on June 10th, 2011 02:00 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]ashkitty on June 10th, 2011 02:02 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]dramaturgca on June 10th, 2011 02:03 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]ashkitty on June 10th, 2011 11:20 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]thefourthvine on June 12th, 2011 09:53 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]dramaturgca on June 13th, 2011 07:17 am (UTC) (Expand)
Stef[info]morningapproach on June 10th, 2011 12:30 am (UTC)
That really sucks :( I think that is a reason I dont frequent comic shops anymore, I just dont feel comfortable in there. You said it and pinpointed it though.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 12th, 2011 09:55 pm (UTC)
It's, yeah, hard to feel comfortable in a comics shop. (It never occurred to me, actually, that I could. I just want to be able to make purchases! And even that is apparently asking too much.)
fryadvocate[info]girl_wonder on June 10th, 2011 12:32 am (UTC)
My first comic shop, I must have been 12? 13? when I started going and I have these memories of it being a boys club that the more I went, the more I became a member of it. And when you're 12 that is a very cool thing.

Then I moved to a small town with 1 comic shop and the guy who ran it adored me. For my business, not my age or gender thank god. He was really good about listening to what I said and not trying to sell me on things I didn't want. Shop closed down, because small towns aren't big on comics.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 13th, 2011 07:21 pm (UTC)
Woe that that excellent shop closed down, but I'm glad you had a good experience there, anyway.
suchthefangirl[info]suchthefangirl on June 10th, 2011 12:36 am (UTC)
Okay, that was horrible and unfair and wrong. Please, know that there are wonderful stores out there. Even in SoCal. I know a bunch. I don't go into them nearly as often as I used to, but damn, I HATE stores like the ones you mention.

The first time I went to a comic convention was this tiny thing in NYC. I will never forget it. The woman's bathroom had two stalls, one of them was out of order. I'm married to a comic book artist and he was set up at the show, we were there for the duration. In the whole time we were there (and this was over 20 years ago so I don't remember if it was two days or just one) I never had to wait to go to the bathroom (and I need to go all the time). The only females there were wives or girlfriends. That is so not true anymore. Now, I go to a convention and I see as many women as men. Hubby is thrilled when I guy at the booth is looking bored and informs us that he's "just the boyfriend." (btw, Hubby talks to everyone regardless if they are the one interested or not, male, female, old or young)

Someone above mentioned Friends of Lulu. I was there when the friends got started (ha. I'm friends with the Friends?!). They are working so hard to not have women treated like this.

Several years ago my family took a year off and went to all 50 states to promote my Hubby's book at the time. We went to all sorts of comic book stores. There were a few that were horrid, and a lots and lots that were wonderful.

I personally don't read a lot of superhero books, I like the more independent stuff. The stores that carry the books that I like are more likely to cater to everyone and are not the old boys clubs. That said, there is no reason that a store that caters to the superhero crowd shouldn't be welcoming to everyone.

I'm wondering if you would be adverse if I showed this post to friends of mine. I think it's really important that they realize that this is still going on. Seriously, I could give this very wide distribution if you were okay with that. We have worked far too hard to make comic books places that are welcoming to women.

Um, this really upsets me. There are some awesome women who own awesome comic book stores, and there are some fantastic men as well. I hate that there are still the jerks out there. My observation: if you walk in and there are lots of boxes, then walk right out again. *shudder*

Please, let me know if you'd be ok with me passing this on, and if you want to know of stores that are worth going to, let me know that as well. They are out there. More than ever before. There are just some losers that think it's still the '80's.
tried to eat the safe banana: Elektra is angry[info]thefourthvine on June 10th, 2011 01:03 am (UTC)
Feel free to pass it around as you see fit! And, wow, I had no idea you were married to a comic book artist. Nifty!

(Also, if you've got recs for comic book stores in or near Long Beach that might be suitable, I will happily take them! Sadly, the earthling means I cannot easily travel long distances for shopping purposes.)
(no subject) - [info]suchthefangirl on June 16th, 2011 10:52 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Admission to the Burning Ruins — 10¢: Wonder Woman[info]laughingacademy on June 10th, 2011 12:40 am (UTC)
Man, I was really lucky. There were two comic book stores where I regularly hung out during high school, Forbidden Planet and Jim Hanley's Universe, and the staff at both were friendly; the manager at the latter offered me a job. Then there was St. Mark's Comics, which had a girl behind the register during at least 50% of my visits.

That said, I will never forget the guy -- a customer -- who blurted, "You're a girl!... But this is a comic book store!...But you're a girl!"
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 13th, 2011 07:25 pm (UTC)
Wow. You BLEW THAT CUSTOMER'S MIND. Being female! In proximity to comic books! THE WORLD IS ENDING.

But I'm glad you had such awesome comic book shops to go to. YAY.
(no subject) - [info]mari_redstar on June 16th, 2011 03:29 am (UTC) (Expand)
AynAtonal: wham![info]aynatonal on June 10th, 2011 01:10 am (UTC)
Oh my *word* that sucks. My comic book store of choice is great, and mostly employs women. But it's in Chicago, so that's probably not so useful to you. Still, I'm outraged on your behalf. What the HELL, dumbass comic book dudes?

Edited at 2011-06-10 01:11 am (UTC)
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 13th, 2011 07:28 pm (UTC)
It does suck. And i have no idea what the hell those guys were thinking. But I am SO GLAD you have a great comic book store. Perhaps when I go to Chicago in August I will check it out!
[info]wolf_heart9 on June 10th, 2011 01:12 am (UTC)
That's so strange. When I lived in Corpus, I went into a comic book store frequently, and most of the time I wasn't there with my ex or any other guy. And the guy running the store (older guy probably in his 50s) was always helpful. Even talked to me about comics, let me know what was new and coming out. I had a $5 pull box there ($5 down once and had a pull box for life). Then my roommate and I moved up here to San Marcos, found the local comic shop, which is run by a woman who not only knows comics (she's in her 50s, I think), she also sells gaming dice, figures, cards, commissioned jewelry and...you'll love this...Avon. She is made of 100% awesome win. Everyone loves her. Guys, girls...all of us. My pull box here...free. I hope you can find a better comic shop. I can't promise you a decent Rogue these days, but there are still good comics.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 13th, 2011 07:30 pm (UTC)
I LOVE SO MUCH THAT SHE ALSO SELLS AVON. Seriously, that made my DAY. I love that she exists, and I'm so glad you have had such good comic book experiences.
Talya Firedancer[info]fyredancer on June 10th, 2011 01:14 am (UTC)
You've described every comic book store I ever went to; despite the fact I was a regular customer at two, I was always invisible. It wasn't the reason I eventually quit comics, but it may have been a factor, for sure.

The misogyny, it reeks, and permeates the entire genre.
tried to eat the safe banana: Batgirl in glasses[info]thefourthvine on June 13th, 2011 07:33 pm (UTC)
It really does permeate the genre. From the highest level on down, damn it. Sorry you've been invisible, too.

*hugs*
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